“Today” show transcript
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- March
- 9
For those of you who missed it, here is a transcript of the John Jay students with author Eve Ensler and school board President Peter Breslin on NBC’s “Today” show this morning. (Many thanks to TJN staff writer Rob Ryser!) Or you can just click “here”:http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=645939f9-ae81-40af-ad5a-80ad0cd283b0&f=05&fg=rss to watch it.
Vieira  The story as I have heard it reported is you wanted to read an excerpt from “The Vagina Monologuesâ€? at an open mic night at the school. School officials said to you, ‘we are not comfortable with this stanza that has the word, vagina, please don’t read it.’ When you got up there, you said you wouldn’t and then you did. And that you were suspended for being insubordinate. Is that the story as you understand it?
Elan Stahl  No, that is not the story as we understand it. The school gave us two options and option A was that we don’t read it…[option B was that we read the monologue] stanza with the word vagina taken out. And they asked us to come to a decision by open mic night. And we left and we said we would think about it. And when we got to open mic night the administration approached us and said ‘did you make a decision’ and we said ‘yes, we will be performing.’ We came up with option C which was to read the entire monologue the way it was written…It upheld the message of the monologue, the moral integrity of the piece of literature and it better represented what women woman across the world.
Vieira  What was the stanza that the administration had so much trouble with?
Stahl  Do you want us to say it?
Vieira  Sure, absolutely.
Megan Reback  “My short skirt is a liberation flag in the women’s army. I declare these streets, any streets…�
All three girls together  “my vagina’s country.�
Vieira  At any point did the school say to you that ‘we want to censure this word, we are uncomfortable with this word, that is what this is about?’
Reback  I mean they just said that the stanza wasn’t appropriate to say in an event that was open to the community but in reality it was only 9th grade students through 12th grade students and parents who were there…Vagina isn’t a word that should be censured for young children also because they know about vaginas … most parents say vagina in their household. It is an important word. It is a part of the body. That is what our main point was.
Vieira  Peter, you represent the school board, you head up the school board, tell me about the school’s decision to, to, um, suspend these girls – they haven’t been suspended at this point.
Peter Breslin  Correct. They were suspended. [The administration decided to] … consider the issue to see if that is going to be upheld or not. Meredith, principals make these kind of calls all the time. Educators across America in every school in America say ‘should this book be read by these students?’ ‘Should this film be shown in this class?’ ‘Should this passage be read at this event?’ It is difficult because sometimes they make very difficult calls. And that is what our principal did in this situation.
Vieira  But what is questionable about the word vagina when used in a non-sexual context?
Breslin  Yeah, honestly, I have no problem with the word vagina. And I will tell you I’ve heard it more in the last four days than I’ve heard it
[Laughter from the girls and the host drown out the remainder of his sentence]
Breslin  …in this point of my life.
Vieira  Well do you think that the principal overreacted? … The girls said one thing and did another.
Breslin  Yeah, I can’t speak for the principal. But I think he felt that at the time he made the right call – a very difficult one I might add.
Vieira  And now what do you think?
Breslin  What I think, honestly is I think we are doing the right thing. I think the superintendent is taking it up and he understands the issue. We are looking at the … [possibility] to let this go and to rescind the suspensions and I might say that I know these girls pretty well. They are friends of my son. I admire what they did. They stood up for what they believed and I have no problem with that.
Vieira  Eve, you have probably said vagina more than anybody I know and you started this all more than a decade ago. What was your reaction when you heard this story?
Eve Ensler  Love these girls. Love them. I mean, first of all I was not shocked that the school resisted saying the word because unfortunately we are still living in a word, world where people are terrified of the word vagina. Vagina. It’s a body part. Elbow, hand. Vagina.
[girls laugh]
Ensler  The fact that we still live in a world where that creates such controversy is disturbing to me.What these girls did is so brilliant. If authority gives you a directive that is unwise and inappropriate to me it is a sign of leadership to refuse that.
Vieira  But the person made a point in saying ‘we thought there might be young people in that audience and he was concerned about them.’
Ensler  …They have one. What are we concerned about? Heaven forbid. Part of saying the word
Vieira  Some people are sensitive to it though, Eve.
Ensler  Sensitive to what? Look at what they are sensitive to. Why don’t we want girls to have language for their bodies? Why don’t we want girls to have agency over their bodies? To know their bodies to love their bodies? Half of the reason why girls end up violated, getting disassociated, getting distracted is because they are not educated about their bodies. Why don’t we want girls and boys to have an awareness of their genitals and to know their bodies?
Vieira (to the girls)  I understand that you were telling me during the open mic night that someone used the F word And was not reprimanded or punished in any way.
Breslin  Yeah, the issue there…and that is one of the things that the superintendent…Were we consistent with the way this thing was handled? We have some things that we need to consider.
Ensler  I would like to speak to that to. I predict to you in that evening words like rape, war and plutonium were used. Why are those words less disturbing words than vagina? Vagina is a place where life comes from where we all pass…We are living in a free country.
Vieira  You three were supposed to meet with the superintendent this morning? But you are here instead.
Stahl  We rescheduled.
Vieira  Well you are going to find out next week whether you will be getting a one day suspension or not. Thanks to all of you. An interesting discussion…
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on Friday, March 9th, 2007 at 11:14 am by Diana Costello.
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Why were John Jay High School administrators concerned about “My Short Skirtâ€? being read, in full, at Open Mic Night? Let’s not attack their personal motives here, or belittle their religious beliefs. Let’s ask the critical question: shouldn’t our kids, who choose to stand up in front of an audience of their own peers and community members to express themselves, decide what they want to say in this public forum? Why should any school official approve or disapprove that material in advance? I personally believe these young women made a responsible choice, selecting material that was not sexually explicit. I also believe we can trust our high school students to make responsible choices. But so what if they do offend? Then we’re all free to object, after the fact. That’s the beauty of our open marketplace of ideas. Open Mic Night is a forum that should encourage free expression by adolescents in our community about the world they live in and the concerns they have. So what if it’s a public forum? All the better. Anyone in our community who attends Open Mic Night should understand that. Don’t bring your children with you if they are too young to be exposed to the ideas and expression that our adolescents find compelling. Don’t come to the event yourself if you can’t take it. We’re talking about speech here, not conduct. The speech we’re talking about may in fact make people in the audience squirm, but it isn’t likely to make any reasonable person start a stampede for the doors, nor do any other real harm. Our high school administrators should respect the laws against prior restraint of speech, and conduct themselves accordingly.
Some have also expressed concern that a promise was made and broken, and that somehow the girls’ supposed insubordination somehow makes a difference here. While I don’t agree, I personally found the explanation presented by these young women on the Today Show persuasive and illuminating. It serves to highlight the scope of the error our high school administrators have made. School officials presented option A (don’t read the piece at all) or option B (read the piece without the stanza). These young women said we’ll think about it, thought about it, and then said they’d decided to read the piece. Any reasonable person who appreciated the importance of this matter in the first place should have understood that constituted option C—a resounding vote of “No” to censorship. The fact that school officials naively misunderstood this to mean “we accept your option B” means that those administrators failed to recognize the core issues presented. I say, administrators who issue unreasonable rules should not be surprised when a few brave people stand up and say “No, I will not follow your unreasonable rules. I will trust my own judgment and follow my conscience instead.” Are there consequences? You bet. There are always consequences in life when we choose the path of civil disobedience. And there is also the reward of having your community recognize and applaud your act of bravery. We should all thank these three young women for reminding us how important open debate on these types of matters is for our society.
OK so now these three students had their day in the sun. As a parent of 4 children, if my kids intentionally disobeyed the principal I would tell them to take their punishment and make sure it does not happen again. I would not want my teenage daughters on tv discussing how meaningful the word vagina is. We should be praising the actions of Principal Leprine and standing behind him not condeming him for doing his job. Mr Leprine made a decision that he felt was appropriate for an event that was taking place in the school that he is responsible for. Why are we even questioning his decision? Mr. Breslin of the school board went on the Today Show with the girls and did not have the guts to defend Principal Leprine. He should have just sat in the middle of the girls and Eve Ensler and held their hands. What ever happened to school discipline and being accountable for your actions!!
What if they said my bra holds my tits?
RV,
I agree. This principal deserves applause not lashings. Who do these people think they are to talk about freedom of speach. Scream what you want from your million dollar homes, scream the word vagina in your country club, scream the word vagina in your place of worship. Go ahead girls embrace your vagina. Speak freely about your vagina so other people think it is OK to speak freely about your vagina.
I look forward to the day they speak freely in their college classes, speak freely at their job and most of all speak freely to their parents. Praise them for they are martyrs. NOT!!!!!
This interview is just another display of the wow factor. Instead of meeting with the superintendent today they choose to go on the today show. Good lessons we are teaching our children. Let’s cut to the chase they are brats that are enjoying the ride.
One last thing if it was about freedom of speach why was the “f” word not suspended. Vagina is not a bad word when used to teach. When used in a poem form the word takes on a different context and people might not understand the context.
Tim, who used the “f” word, where and when?
The first problem…the school should not have had an ‘’open mic’’ night unless it was prepared for whatever a high-school kid could think to read. That’s a given.
Second, the time for the kids and parents to fight was not after the fact…it was before the performance. This wasn’t brave…it was cowardly, really. An eye-to-eye discussion without the benefit of the uproar would have been the way to go.
Third…I really hope these girls don’t go by the lessons of The Vagina Monologues. They should be growing into responsible people…not appendages and torsos governed by their vaginas. The play is a joke that sends women 10 steps backwards.
I am a father of 3 girls, I served in the militray and understand the idea of following orders. My first thought is that allowing the students to walk their way into the 15 minute spotlight using the word vagina as a tool is simple… they defied authority. That defiance comes from simple principles taught at many locations, the first being home! If all 3 girls parents instilled the discipline they deserved at early ages, they would understand what it means to say “NO”.
I ask the parents of these 3 adolescent girls, when you tell them not to drive drunk will they do it? When you tell them not to have sex will they do it? When you tell them not to kill someone will they? My response to you is this… No, they won’t listen because they don’t understand the word NO. They don’t understand the concept of actions and reactions.
In closing I ask this to the parents of these girls; go to work tell your boss “NO’ and then expect to remain receiving the same respect and privalges they currently extend to you.
Freedom of speech is not the question, following authority is.To the media, it is a way to distort facts and ruin the years of good this man has done for previous students and this community.
A Mom it is impossible for a student to have a logical discussion with any non-teaching member of a public school. Any parent that has had the honor of raising lively children can attest to this as fact.
Public schools are constrained by laws and speech can be restricted but only under circumstances that where the speech is likely to cause significant disruption of discipline or order. Using “Vagina� in a reading of the “Vagina Monologues� just cannot meet that test. You might say the Principal could ban the reading entirely however he knows that is something he might no be able to do with-in the law. In a sense he is screwed. Therefore, he makes a choice and it was a bad one.
Now as for the girls, personally, I think that this sort of restriction on language needs to be discussed and in our society, it is always decided after the fact who is right or who is wrong. There just is no way to remedy a wrong that did not happen. Therefore, the girls needed to say “vaginaâ€? in order to find out if the Principal has the right to ban that word in that reading of the play. It does not matter if the kids knew what they were doing or are just fame seeking. The discussion now centers on what is with in the law and what is not. A commander in the military know to what limit he or she needs to enforce discipline and he or she knows that excessive reliance on submission is ineffective to unit cohesiveness. Drawing the line in the sand at vagina is useless to school discipline as is an in house suspension is as a method to change the girl’s behaviors. I would make sure I brought along my copy of “Who’s Afraid of Virginia Woolfâ€? a book banned when I was young. And this is why a topic like this is dear to me. When I was young, I lived in a place where book burnings were done once a year and that book was taken from my mother. The local priest accompanied by the police carrying machine guns when through everyone’s homes looking for material that the pope thought should not be read by Catholics. In addition, the Catholic Church was the official state religion so no one could read in a book, see on TV or movies, or hear on the radio anything unapproved. It is very easy to slip into that mode of thinking and not realize that you have lost something precious and not appreciated it until it is a very hard fight to get it back. Think hard about backing a Principal of a public school remember he is a representative of the government’s policies and should be scrutinized for his decisions based on the law and not gut emotional reactions. Even as I have one I do try and understand the underling issues and not just the in you face issues. Just as an aside I do have children in that age range and by the time they were 7 or 8 we had already had many a discussion on the realities of their bodies and I don’t remember the word vagina ever causing a an issue.
Lastly, if you do not support the girls perhaps you should think of changing the name of the school.
Authority sshould be respected, however not followed at all costs (i.e. life is not a war in Canada, yet); it is to be used with your heart and head! As adults, we know that we are often wrong; thus, children must have liberty to discuss and challenge our authority, considering that more often than not, the ones with the authority are wrong. We all can attest to that. The debate here had more depth than a simple order of not to kill anyone!!!! And I would actually arguee that when a kid does not drive and drink or does not kill; he is listening to himself, not his parents. Great debate… would it have been the same for penis?
Road apples, once again, the time to fight such a decision is before the event. Now there’s nothing in the way of students publishing any picture or article in the school newspaper…just do it, and then worry about the consequences later and claim freedom of speech. And, in my experience, if you don’t like the answer that a building administrator gives you, you continue the quest up the administrative line. In most cases, sanity reigns.
This all has very little to do with the word “vagina.” And as for changing the name of the school…sorry, you lost me on that one…
A Mom, you are absolutley right. No one knows what they are talking about. I am a student, and even i know the right from wrong, maybe its because my parents taught me normally. Unlike some. When your boss says no, you don’t do it. These three girls can have a fun time finding a job becuase i’m pretty sure no one is going to keep them in the job if they disobey them. And vagina…seriously people…”there is a time and a place for evertyhing.” I’m not saying this monologue is wrong for certain people. But in the environment it was in, i t was just not appropriate. Shame on these three girls.
They must love this attention too. You can tell.
Kids are brats, they looked like fools on the Today Show, their parents obivously are clueless enablers….